Introduction to Margy Schaller and Sober Life Rocks
Welcome back to another episode of the Drug Prevention Power Hour. I’m your host, Jake White, and today I’m hanging out with a new friend, Margie Schaller. And Margie is best known as a speaker coach and owner of the Schaller Speaker Academy.
She got sober in 2005, and back then there was still a lot of stigma around sobriety. And when she finally got the courage to publicly share her sobriety at 10 years sober, she was once again advised to stay silent and avoid judgment. Now with 19 years of sobriety, she’s stepping out of the shadows and celebrating a lifestyle that has brought her clarity and inner peace. And the thing that I want to talk to you most about as Margie is the co-founder of Sober Life Rocks, a membership-based community of people who choose not to drink, are sober-ish, sober-curious, or sober wingmen. Their mission is to help normalize sober choices and offer support to professionals who choose not to drink or drink less at work events. That’s so cool, Margie. Thanks for hanging out with me today.
I’m super excited, Jake.
Yeah, okay, so I have to ask right away. Well, I guess, you know what, let’s start with the simple stuff. Where are from? What you do with Sober Life Rocks? And then I’ve gotten just really curious about your journey to get here. So we’ll dive in there. I gotta call myself John Snow. Yeah, give us your good old intro.
Sure, sure, Yeah, so I’m in Seattle. Been here for about five years, transplanted from San Diego, so went to totally opposite climates. But my co-founder, Laura Nelson and I founded Sober Life Rocks a year ago. And the best way to describe what happened is to tell you the story about how that was born. So if I can dive right into that.
Yeah, that’s what I want to know. Yeah, yeah, So, you know, as you mentioned in my intro, I’ve been secretly sober in my professional life all this time. And so very, very few people knew that I didn’t drink and Laura was one of them. And a year ago, we were at a women’s retreat and it was about 125 women and we knew most of them. And she was on this mind, body health panel.
And she’s been sober at that time for about four years and she’s always been like just, you know, out loud sober, like TikTok sober. And so, so she was sharing about how, you know, it had just been this life changer for her and how it had been kind of like the final puzzle piece in getting her life on a better track. And just sort of spontaneously, she said, you know, how many women in this room don’t drink for whatever reason?
So in that moment, I had this choice. I’m like, man. And so I start slowly raising my hand and I’m looking around the room and Jake, like 25% of the women in the room are doing the same thing. And we knew all these people and we had no idea about that, about each other. And Laura and I looked at each other, we’re like, what? How is this possible? And so we realized that there’s a problem. And the problem is this shame and stigma. And maybe we share it with our friends or family, but in the workplace, it’s like we’re afraid. We’re afraid to share that we’re sober for crying out loud.
Isn’t that weird that we’re afraid to share a healthy choice?
Right? It’s the only drug that if you don’t do it, you are shamed. Yeah. Yeah.
So we grabbed each other, we went to lunch and we sat down and I said, you this has to change, but the change has to start with me. Like I can’t put baby in the corner anymore.
And so that’s when Sober Life Rocks was born. And we said, you know, the first thing is to just normalize it, to normalize choices that people have around alcohol. And that means if they choose to drink alcohol, cool. If they choose not to drink alcohol, cool. Like it’s all good. It shouldn’t matter what’s in your cup.
Yes. Wow. Okay. See, I know exactly now Kira wanted us to meet because I went through the same thing what you had found in that room. That’s how I felt on my college campus was, as soon as I told somebody I didn’t drink or smoke, I felt judged. I felt like they didn’t get me or they wouldn’t invite me to things. And that did happen to a certain extent. And so I just learned, you should not tell people that. Like that’s not socially acceptable. And then there came this moment when I read a statistic of what you saw in that room. Like you saw in the room that there are more people like you. I read it in an article and thought, all well, I’m gonna test that then and see if they’re out there. And once I started throwing these drug-free, you know, house parties, Right those people showed up and it wasn’t just the people raising their hands, it was the other ones who maybe they did drink other nights, but they wanted to come check out this new thing where they can have fun and make friends without that extra substance involved. So it’s really interesting.
Exactly. And that’s why we, that’s why we had this notion of having this big tent. Because what we have learned is that there are people who, you know, maybe they’re sober like me in recovery. Maybe they don’t drink for religious reasons, or maybe they just want the healthier lifestyle. And then we have a number of people who they just don’t drink at professional events because they want to show up as their best self. Right? Or maybe they’re sober-ish all across the board.
They might have a drink at a wedding, right? A celebratory champagne or something, but in general, it’s not their lifestyle. And all of these people are all struggling with the same, like, let’s hide what we’re doing behind a club soda and lime. Right? It’s the most absurd thing.
Right. Well, okay, I want to save, I want to remember to ask you this and I don’t know, I want to dive into what Sober Life Rocks does, like how does it show up in the world and then I want to remember, so I’ll say it out loud now, I want to ask you how it was in the corporate world those 10 years when you didn’t say something, like what that experience was all about, but first can you tell us about Sober Life Rocks and what do you guys do?
The Birth of Sober Life Rocks
Sure. Yeah, that’s a great question. And honestly, I’m to be fully transparent. Like we are a work in progress. We are here to serve our community. And so what that looks like is is ever evolving because the needs of the group are at its core. What we wanted to do is two things. The first thing was to really provide a safe space for people who choose not to drink or drink less where we were celebrated, where it’s okay, like it’s all good. And so we do have a membership, it’s $9 a month. And the idea is, first of all, we send daily emails, short little emails, and these are inspirational or thought provoking. But the idea is that if you’re going to an event, let’s say you’re going to a national sales meeting, like you’ve got us in your back pocket, right? When you wake up in the morning, you’ve got that little jolt of, oh, okay, it’s good, I’m good.
Right? And that, yeah, exactly. Exactly. Right now we’re actually building the fastest growing sober community on LinkedIn, Sober Life Rocks Professionals. And there we’re just trying to have conversations. know, when somebody goes to an event and they’re like, my God, this crazy thing just happened. Like we can talk about it there. Right? So, and we’ve tried different things, we’re open to different things. So as the community’s growing, we’re we’re pivoting.
We also do have a podcast which I run, and so we just try to bring in interesting guests as well and talk about just this dynamic. There’s lots and lots of people who do a great job of helping people get sober. That is not sober life rocks. Our niche is that we haven’t found anywhere else that really addresses that workplace. In your personal life, you can choose to go to a New Year’s Eve party or not.
But if you are asked to go to a work party, you kind of have to go. And if drinking is the currency of connection at most of these events and you’re sober, it can feel uncomfortable. So we really just wanted to create a home for those people. So that’s kind of like niche number one of what we do. But the second thing that we wanted to do was because alcohol is so pervasive and meetings are struggling to get people to show up. only thing that the conferences or sales meetings or even happy hours, like what do you do when you go to some event is like, hey, let’s meet for happy hour. Or if you’re a sales person on the road and you’d have to take people out, like let’s go out and get some drinks. It’s the thing that we do to gather in our professional worlds.
And when you say meetings, you’re you know, we just hit, we just, as a team, just hit this great milestone. Let’s go out and get some drinks.
Right. And is that why when you, in your bio, you even mentioned like, you were advised not to tell people this. Was it, as you had said, that connection currency? Were people worried that you weren’t going to be successful because you wouldn’t connect with others? Or what was behind that statement?
Creating a Safe Space for Sober Professionals
Well, if it’s okay, I’m gonna reserve that one for more of my origin story and I’ll get there in a minute. But what we wanted to do is really just like lift the veil of awareness to create some idea in the minds of people who are putting together these events that can we do better? Can we offer some way to connect that isn’t just over alcohol?
And so actually Laura just published this book, The Inclusive Event Planner, and it’s free for download on our website or you can buy it on Amazon. And it’s filled with just ideas about other ways to gather or adult beverages that don’t have alcohol in them. And just understanding what the challenges are and how can we be more sober inclusive. So that’s kind of the second leg of Sober Life Rocks is trying to change the industry just to be aware.
Okay, I love that. So just so I understand it correctly, the first area is your community where there’s no stigma. You know that you are accepted, you belong, and you have your people and your support. If you are sober for any reason or any amount of time, you can be there. You can be one of many. The second part… Okay, perfect. And the second one is you are a resource for anyone who’s yes. And you can hide in plain sight if you want to hosting or planning a professional conference or meeting to be more mindful and inclusive of those who aren’t using that substance. Okay.
Precisely. I mean, it’s no different than the days when vegetarian offerings, right? It used to be like your offerings was a salad or steamed vegetables. Or if there was a buffet line, like you had to go over to the special table to go pick up your vegetarian meal, right? I mean, it’s crazy to think back to those days, but that’s how it was. Or gluten free. I mean, it was just you had like this special thing. And here comes a special plate out here with this big sign on it. you’re different.
Right? Today, it’s not that way. Today, it’s easy. But restaurants and bars, I think, are getting better at having a mocktail menu. But Jake, the craziest thing is, is that in the meeting space, these conference centers and these hotels are not. We go to these events and I travel a lot for work and so does Laura. And you go into the big conference room at the end of it and they roll up the little black bars, crank up the music, turn down the lights, and everybody gets smashed.
Wow, that’s wild. I guess since I started my business in college, I’ve been doing this alternative. I’ve been sheltered from the corporate, I guess, lifestyle or culture and how much it still might feel like being back on a college campus, I guess, in some of these.
It is, and there’s that feeling of it being like the good old boys club a little bit. What’s really cool, and maybe this is part of it too for you, is that the younger generations are not quite so keen on just getting smashed event after event. They’re a lot more health-minded, a lot more conscious of wanting to show up as their best selves. So I really have hope for the future. But in the meanwhile, everybody who’s planning these things, one of the examples was this same conference, this women’s conference where Laura and I first had that aha moment. The woman who runs it is just this lovely southern woman. Beautiful, giving, thoughtful, and she loves her wine, which is cool. And so every year she hosts the group at her home. She’s got this beautiful gigantic home. And after that moment, when 25 % of the room said that they don’t drink. She comes running up to Laura and says, all I have is wine and beer. Do you think I should get something else? Like it just never occurred to her that anybody would want something else.
Right. Wow. The same thing happens to you at weddings. I feel like I’ve been to weddings where the bridal party is concerned about me being in the bridal party because if everyone else is getting smashed and I’m not, am I going to have any fun? Am I going to be dancing with everyone and making a fool of myself? And the answer is yes, but they can’t leave it until they see it.
And what was. Right? Yes, absolutely. I think that’s a big fear a lot of people have is that, I ever going to have fun again? And the answer is not only do I have fun, but I remember how much fun it was without shame. Mm-hmm. Yeah. that’s cool. I love your platform. Sober Life Rock.
Margy’s Journey: Overcoming Stigma and Shame
Thank you. And it does, right? Okay, so you asked me a question about that moment when I was shamed. I got sober at a time, you 19 years ago when there still was quite a bit of stigma about being sober. And I remember going to, I got sober and Alcoholics Anonymous, and I remember going to AA meetings, and the club that I went to was on this main road in the area that I lived in. And I remember being afraid that people would see me. So I’d park around the back and I’d wait till the red light had turned green so people were driving faster and I’d sneak around to go up to the meetings. Like that’s the kind of shame and stigma that I felt was going on at the time. And so back then I had lots of people suggest that, you you might just not want to say anything to people at work because you don’t want them thinking, you know, you’re under the bridge alcoholic failure which I was totally good with. But at 10 years sober, I was just like, come on, like at this point, anybody who judges me, like whatever. And I had the opportunity to, I’m a speaker coach. And so I had the opportunity to give a talk at a conference that was full of speakers. And so this was my big moment. Like I was gonna introduce myself to this group and I was gonna, you know, launch my business and get all kinds of great opportunities.
And one of the things that I always teach people is that when you’re first giving a talk to a brand new audience, it’s really important for them to get to know you, like you, and trust you. So I thought long and hard about it I said, you know, my essence is I want to give back. And so I told this, I told a story and I’m going just give you the abbreviated version of it but basically what I shared was you know I grew up in an alcoholic household my mom was an alcoholic and life was chaos and I vowed I’d never be like her and of course by my 20s I had turned out to be very much like her and I was creating my own chaos in my own life and my own kids lives and I’m sure that along the way there was people there who could have helped me but I didn’t see them and it wasn’t until I got sober, and at the time I was able to say 10 years ago, that I had these amazing women show up my life. And people who helped me finish growing up and helped me learn to be more professional or learn how to dress properly or be a better mother or learn how to be a better wife or employee, like all the things that my mom didn’t raise me to know and during my drinking days I never knew. And so because of that, I’m so grateful and I can never, ever repay those people. But the best that I can do is to pay it forward. And that means that I wanna help you become the best person that you can be.
Now at that moment, the entire audience was on the edge of their seats, waiting to hear what I have to say next. And the rest of my talk went fantastic. And I had people, Jake, coming running up to me afterwards saying like, how can I hire you? How can I hire you? Like all my dreams came true in that moment. And then later that evening, two separate people came up to me who were very influential in that group and they both said something like, great job, Margie, but you might not want to talk about that sober thing. Like I wouldn’t want anybody to judge you.
And because that was my absolute worst fear, I never talked about it again in my professional world. Until that moment when Laura said, who here doesn’t drink? And now you understand why I was so hesitantly raising my hand and why I was so stunned that I wasn’t the only one. There didn’t need to be this shame or stigma anymore.
Yeah. And it was like that fear or anxiousness for you to share who you were. It survived because you felt isolated in your decision. And once you realized you weren’t the only one, this courage was lifted. And you knew, hey, you can’t hurt me anymore by this. There’s so much freedom and inspiration in knowing you’re not alone.
And that’s what we want to stand for. We want other people in their professional lives to see you’re not alone.
That’s really cool. I love that story, Yeah, that’s such It makes me choke up thinking about it, yeah. And what’s great is that we have had since then people come up to us who have heard our story and heard this mission and come up to us and just be like, I never ever told anybody before, but I’m sober too. And it’s like, we just get to give them a big hug and just throw the love around them. And people don’t have to be shouting from the rooftops like we are today. That’s why I said they can hide in plain sight in our group because we have so many people who…
They’re not there for recovery reasons, but nobody questions why we’re part of the community. We have people who, as you said in the intro, we call our sober wingmen. And I would say maybe like 15 % of our members are drinkers who completely support this mission. And they just want to be a part of, allies, if you will, just to raise up the awareness and the celebration and reduce the stigma.
Yeah, that’s so cool. So what I really resonate with is that maybe you had this feeling of, can’t share who I am because it will affect my profession or affect my social life. And that’s exactly what I experienced and became my motivation for helping young people do what I do, which is basically, we’re running sober life rocks, but for young people. And so when I’m in tears after a speech and working with students, helping them start these sober clubs and create events, I tear up because when they say, I realize I’m not alone and I don’t need to hide who I am anymore because I remember that feeling for me and what it meant.
And because I don’t have a recovery story, for any times a student comes up to me and says either, hey, you gave me the strength to keep my decision or you know what, I’m actually not going to use marijuana anymore. This was really helpful. And I know that I can still have a social life. Like automatically, I’m just like, my gosh, you know, this is the best job in the world. But I can see myself in the situation and the fear that they had and imagine the freedom that they feel getting to tell at least one person and then just to get to say, I’m so proud of you. Like what I’m learning is that needs to be the phrase that is the most coming out of my mouth after I speak is I’m so proud of you. I’m so proud of you. Because if people can learn that young, that that’s a good thing to be proud of, I think the world will change.
Empowering Young People and Building Community
1000 percent which a lot of people don’t, AAA is not for everybody and I no longer am deeply in AA. There’ll always be my foundation, but it’s not part of what I do today. But I think that the idea of celebrating milestones is still important because every day that you make that decision is a good day, but when you string together 30 days or 60 days or five years, whatever it is, like that is something to be celebrated and lifted up. and that notion of saying, somebody saying to you, like, I’m proud of you. That is a big deal because it counters that shame and it counters that stigma. Those are old messages, old tapes that don’t have any place in today’s world.
Yeah, exactly. I love that sobriety today is becoming more acceptable. There’s still stigma around asking for help and mental health and sobriety to a certain extent, but there’s a movement. Like you said, the young people are more healthy and health conscious, beauty conscious, everything. But also our generation of adults are saying, hey, I’m going to share my story too because media and commercialism promised me that alcohol was going to do this for me and that’s the way I grew up. And it’s not the truth. It didn’t deliver those things. Instead, it took my freedom. It took my relationships. It took my health. And I want it back.
Now it’s interesting that you focus on young people because, the idea of a lot of these conferences is that they’re trying to attract the young people. And the only thing that they know to do that with is loud music and, and booze. One of the things that we talk about is can we do better, even just with the gatherings that we put together, can it be something that’s cause driven and have some sort of like charity fundraiser where we’re doing something for the local food bank? Or can we even bring in the food bank and have a meal packing session? Can we bring in some local people who can have a panel about what’s going on in the community? Like, are there things that we can do that would still be interesting and still fun and bonding, but not just the loud music and the bars.
Yeah, I think that providing loud music in a bar to attract young people isn’t working as well as they think it might be. It’s probably they’re thinking, when I was young, that’s what I like to do. But young people today, like you mentioned, they’re cause oriented. They want to see good things in the world. They also want real connection because we’re not getting them from our phones. And so when we see the real thing, we really value it.
And so we can create those experiences where you’re not pressured to go out and dance or listen to loud music. It’s like, no, we love music, but you don’t have to blast it at us. two, give us something to do together where we don’t have to be social butterflies. So, Margie, if you and I are packing these meals together and there’s music where there’s no pressure for us to be social butterflies. We can joke around and have fun and connect easier because we’re not staring at each other. We’re doing something side by side, the pressure’s off and we can make conversation at whatever pace we feel comfortable with. And that’s super helpful. And also providing games and competitions that facilitate natural relationships and excitement without any social lubricant. That is so effective for young people. And I think everybody, we love competing, we love goofing around and talking trash to one another. Those are cool tips.
Yeah. My dream, so tell me if this would be appealing to the crowd that you know. My dream is these conference rooms, know, the big ones, they have these accordion doors that can like segment them into smaller rooms, right? So imagine you rent out the whole thing and you put the accordion doors two thirds of the way closed, but leave them one third so you can cross between them. And then one third on the end is the loud music and the dance floor.
Now in the middle section, so you can still hear that music, but it’s not blaring so much, is like carnival games. And then in the final section, it’s like a lounge setting with tables and sofas and quiet little lamps. So if you’re in that third section and you hear your favorite song, you can be like, hang on, I’m going to go dance to the song and then dance, dance, dance, and then come on back and sit back down with your people or stay in the carnival room and play lawnmowing or ring toss or whatever the fun things are. Like, I don’t know, what do you think?
Okay. I love that for so many reasons. The first being you’ve taken care of every type of introvert or extrovert. have a place to call home and still be a part of the event to not feel left out. Two is there’s no way you would have known this, but when we teach students how to throw good events, we teach them to host their event from room to room, meaning you might start with the connection room which I would open the carnival first, right? As soon as you jump into that event, you’re playing games and you’re making friends. That’s a great energy and way to start an event. And then when that room fills up or when you’re ready, you open that second room and maybe it’s the dance floor or maybe it’s that extra sitting room.
And what happens is the party never feels empty. It feels great. It feels fun. And now you have choices where you want to take it because the ice was broken from the initial first impression of your event. And you’re like, dang, this is cool. I’m going to stay. And then you have the options of where you take your friends and your connections. And like I said, yeah, we’re tired of dancing. We’re kind of sweaty. Let’s go grab a Gatorade and let’s go to the lounge room or whatever that is. So I love that. I love that so much lounge. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. That’s my dream. That’s what I want. That’s what I want when I go to my next conference and I just have to talk somebody into it. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah.
Yes, that’s so cool. Well, Margie, we’re at time right now. I want to give people a chance to follow you, what you’re doing. So let’s do this. If you could give, before we get your info, if you could give one piece of advice to someone who’s planning a conference or an event to be more inclusive and to adapt what you’re doing, what’s that one piece of advice you would give them?
Advice for Inclusive Event Planning
First and foremost is just to have alcohol-free options that are not sticky juice. Like we can have just as interesting drinks as the ones with alcohol in them and then put what the options are in a little sign on the bar so that somebody who’s feeling anxious can just point at it and say, I want one of those.
Yep, that would be the easiest fastest thing that you could possibly do. Okay, that’s fantastic. That’s really, really cool. And then, Margie, where can people go to learn more about Sober Life Rocks and all your great initiatives that you’re doing?
Sure. Well, first and foremost is our website. So soberliferocks.com. And if you want to be part of the conversation, if you go to LinkedIn and search in groups for sober life rocks professionals, it’s free to join, join the conversation, whether you are somebody who drinks, doesn’t drink, interested in the conversation, meeting planners, HR, bosses, employees, it’s open to everybody. So we would love to have you join us there.
That’s wonderful. Margie, thank you for what you’re doing. Hey, I’m proud of you after a decade, you are living out loud, sharing, and I’m sure inspiring people just like your friends did for you.
Thank you and thank you for having me on and I hope that anybody listening who is a professional and feels like they might be the only one in their community or at their work, you’re not alone. We’re here for you, whether you join us or not. We just wanna know that you are not alone and it’s all good.
Yes! That’s a great way to end. This has been another amazing episode of the Drug Prevention Power Hour. Make sure to follow Sober Life Rocks, check out their website, check out Vive18.com, all our platforms. And if you love this episode, please share it with a friend, leave a review of the Drug Prevention Power Hour, and we’ll see you next Monday for another episode.
