“Youth Substance Use and Mental Health Challenges: Insights from Jessica Fowler”

[00:00:05] Jake White: And welcome back to another episode of Party Talk where, you guessed it, we empowered leaders in youth drug prevention. By this time, you’re probably tuning in on a Monday. And this episode is going to be incredible. I’m hanging out with Jessica Fowler, she does prevention work and mental health work out in North Carolina. So I’m really excited to talk with her see what she’s seeing in the field, just her background, and then maybe what things we can borrow from her what’s working all that good stuff. So, Jessica, welcome to the show.

[00:00:35] Jessica Fowler: Thank you so much for having me. I’m very excited to be talking to you all today.

[00:00:39­] Jake White: Of course, let’s start with an intro because I know a little bit about you. But if someone were meeting you for the first time and says, tell me about yourself. What would you share?

[00:00:53] Jessica Fowler: That’s a big question. So overall, I would just share that I started out my career in substance use actually in the treatment world. I started in about 2010. And I moved my way into counseling work to treatment. And they got a master’s in professional counseling, and that at that point, I want to do more community work, I want to do more to prevent substance use. And there’s just happened to be an opening at where I work now do a substance use prevention wasn’t quite sure everything that it was, but they hired me and I have an amazing like supervisor who has really led and we took off. So now I’m doing a lot of substance use prevention work in two counties, and I have also moved into Nigeria to work with suicide prevention. So I saw everything right there.

[00:01:46] Jake White: That’s incredible work. Thank you for what you’re doing, Jessica. What are you seeing as far as maybe in North Carolina? So I’m from Phoenix. I worked in North Carolina a few times, but you’re, you’re now a local expert, and you’ve done your certification and everything? What are some things that you’re seeing out there for youth prevention and what students are might be struggling with.

[00:02:14] Jessica Fowler: So what we’re hearing a lot because we do a lot of work, actually, with our youth, where I work, we have some great people I work with that do a lot of youth empowerment groups, they’re really our leaders. And we guide them that they really take leadership. So we have a group of you, they were actually Africa recently where you were there as well. And when I think actually even did a presentation there, so they’re leading a lot with tobacco, and vaping and doing vaping prevention, they worked out like “PhotoVoice” projects, really advocating about bringing more awareness to your babies, not a safer alternative, how to prevent vaping in schools, things like that. But when they’re working on the baby, they’ve been sharing with us and even in their community members about the struggles they’re experiencing with their unseen with their peers with mental health challenges. So they’ve been doing a lot of research and then talking to leadership, adult, and things like that, about how it all ties in. And even like vaping isn’t a coping strategy for anxiety, it actually increases anxiety, which not all youth are aware of. So they’ve been doing a lot of work with that. And that’s what we’ve been hearing a lot about is just that struggle with that mental health challenges and illness first, and then how some youth are turned into substance use as a way to cope using the youth in that.

“Youth-Led Prevention Initiatives: PhotoVoice Projects and Mental Health First Aid”

[00:03:45] Jake White: I love that your youth are engaged in it. They’re saying, we’re going to help be the solution and taking proactive approach. Because you and I have some education around it. Not every student does. And they’re using these substances thinking like, “Oh, this is making me feel better.” And what they don’t realize is this, as soon as you put down that device, now you have withdrawal symptoms on top of your mental health issues. And you’re just stacking on issues on issues on issues instead of tackling the root of the problem, which is mental health and having positive coping skills. So how are your youth going about educating, what kind of projects are they doing to try to get the word out?

[00:04:31] Jessica Fowler: They done a “PhotoVoice” projects that I mentioned, we actually have some youth who trained and teen Mental Health First Aid this summer. So we offer that to our youth empowerment groups, and then they are able to help support peers, give some information to their peers, and help them get to an adult that they trust.

[00:04:53] Jake White: Well, let me stop you there too, because you said, “PhotoVoice” project. If I have no idea what that is, I’m just imagining Instagram where you have a voiceover on photos? Is that what it is?

[00:05:10] Jessica Fowler: I mean, some of them could be. So what are you saying is if you actually if you go to like, there’s a website for “PhotoVoice”, I really wish my coworker was here, she’s a real leader in that one. For the youth that we worked with, they created ads that away some of them, but a lot, they can be used so many different ways that we have some that some did a comic strip, and we blow it up on a poster for them. And then we had a community wide forum where they were at a panel, they were talking about them. And different aspects, they all focus on vaping prevention. So some of the health approach, some took the community approach like finding vape products on a playground, and how little kids are getting exposed to it finding these things. And then some were like, let’s make schools vape free, and then set up, what it would look like at a school, but it was fake, but what it would look like, and things like that. So it’s just like a different way to have a campaign in a way.

[00:06:10] Jake White: That’s good to know. So their campaign, whether it’s hosting an event where they’ll talk to community, or parents or an art project, and then explaining it or like a PSA type deal, where they’re creating content to share, and then you use another term. So you said, Mental Health First Aid, tell me more about that?

[00:06:33] Jessica Fowler: So the National Council of mental well-being in partnership, it actually all started Australia. But it came over here with the National Council of mental well-being and in about 2000, I’m trying to get my dates 19, as they partnered with Lady Gaga was Born This Way Foundation. And they brought teen Mental Health First Aid, which is for either sophomores, their seniors or ages 15, 18 at use already organizations and they get three. But if you think about medical first aid, like that, for mental health challenges, so they’re not learning to diagnose, but how to provide support, because teens go to their friends usually first, how to provide them support, or even how to help a friend who may they may be noticing some challenges or changes and signs and symptoms, and then how to talk to a trusted adult. So we are able, I’m an instructor, and that we’re able to train our youth it is and we have a couple people that I work with who have attended, instructor training got certified. So we work with our youth every summer that are new, and they get trained in it. So then they have the knowledge base, but they also want this to be able to help support their peers.

“Tobacco Culture in North Carolina: Past and Present Trends”

[00:07:47] Jake White: That’s really cool. I’m already what we’re like six minutes into this, I’m already learning something new. This is incredible. Because you said you’re trained in it now, can you give me a short preview or example of what maybe just a few bullet points on what are the students leaving this with, or maybe a few key strategies, knowing you can’t give us the entire training, but in 30 minutes, but a few maybe things that are good tips for anyone to know?

[00:08:23] Jessica Fowler: We always in all of our programs in even some of ours that are not teen Mental Health First Aid. The main takeaway we always teach our youth is talking to a trusted adult, helping them identify who their trusted adults or whether it’s a coach, whether it’s a parent, or guardian or whoever it could be routine mental health first day, they actually learn an action plan of how to support their friend, but it all still goes back to talking to a trusted adult, not putting that weighed on themselves that, “I have to help and fix my friend. But this is how I can help my friend by talking to them, like who is your trusted adult?” And if they don’t have one helping like, oh, well, here’s my trusted, “Oh, can I go with you? Do you want me to talk with you, take you to talk to my trusted adult and I’ll go and support you through that.” And then just being there friends, we’re in an amazing group of young people we’re raising right now that they are already doing a lot of work with decreasing stigma. So a lot of times they’re already ready to go talk to people, if they’re like, let’s go talk about this which is great compared to like my generation. So that is really teaching them how to do it in ways that helpful instead of taking that on their selves thinking that they have to solve this problem because a lot of times, they can’t and they really need that professional support where their friend does and is also educating them on what is professional help, because not everybody knows it’s not widely talked about so then they have that information that they can tell their brains out, reduce fears really empowering.

[00:10:06] Jake White: That’s fantastic. I’m definitely going to look more into that it sounds really, really helpful. And to what I understand from it just like a takeaway for the people listening, is when we’re talking about mental health. First of all, this program is a great one to get trained on, if you’re looking for training for your youth prevention clubs and things like that. The second thing is the tips that you said is that all points towards finding that trusted adult, someone where you can go to whether it’s that student, or if the student you’re helping doesn’t feel like they have a trusted adult, then at least the person who’s trained on it has someone that they can go to. And they can go together, I imagine that’s really comforting to say, I’m not going to send you to some stranger’s house or to call them, let’s go together, that would be awesome thing to do as a friend. And then finally to not also to have the posture, that’s not your job to quote fix this person that too much, they’re professionals who did this work. So your job is more to be a supportive friend, to be there for them in with them, and bring them to that next step would be that to be that trusted adult, and then have the resources to get professional help, if that’s what’s needed. So that sounds really cool. I also want to ask you about being in North Carolina. So when I’ve been there, there’s something I noticed just by sight. And I don’t know if this is true, or if it was just a place I was in. But here’s what happened. In college, I went to Boone, North Carolina, up in Appalachian State, and first time in North Carolina. So I’m all nouns, beautiful, nicest people. What struck me though, it seemed like the majority of people had a cigarette hanging out of their mouth. And it was so different from Wisconsin, if beer is culturally accepted, it’s our industry. So to say you don’t drink beer is really, really weird. I felt like in North Carolina, tobacco was the industry. And if you didn’t smoke, it’s like you weren’t a North Carolina person. Like, I don’t know if this is just my perception, or if that’s there’s a little bit of truth to it, or I just made something up in my head. What have you seen as far as being in prevention, and tobacco use? Is there any sort of cultural thing happening, and how would you describe it?

[00:12:43] Jessica Fowler: The other thing, it really depends on where you are in North Carolina, I grew up here. So I remember the culture of walking around seeing everybody in the 80s and 90s, with a cigarette and then you see it change, like when I was I think was like 2009 and 2010 are lost, he has smoking bars, he has a restaurant and it’s more out bad. But I mean, it was a tobacco state. They’re still tobacco farms, where I live in North Carolina, not even a mile down the road is a small tobacco barn. The two counties that I get to do work in are very different. So one county is still pretty rural, and it’s still livelihood, it’s tobacco. For myself, I don’t see a lot of people smoking now compared to what it used to be. But there’s definitely that history. And there’s a lot of pride in your history of your state. But I do think it depends, I know depending on towards college campuses, now I’m seeing business, college town as well for the baby, and that I see going on as well, um, , because I lived also near University. So you do see that, I don’t know if that’s just because it’s being marketed towards that population group. And even tobacco big prior to vaping was marketed to where it’s the younger population look things like that. So it’s really hard to say I don’t get out of North Carolina alleged to be able to notice any difference, but a tobacco state in a manufacturer for it for a long time.

[00:14:20] Jake White: I mean, that’s just important to acknowledge right there is, you’ve lived in this state for a long time. I came from a different state. So in comparison to me, it could have just been more people are smoking cigarettes. So I’m like, “Whoa, North Carolina, this huge cloud”. Where you’re thinking, I was here in the 90s. And when there was a lot of cigarettes, it’s actually reduced. So you’re thinking this is not that from what I’ve seen. It is always relative to your experience. And what’s cool though is that it sounds like it’s decreasing the use. And now of course, we’ve got the challenge of vaping products. And it’s reversing all the work that we did, or we’re having to do it over. But hopefully we’re learning just like the cigarette companies and as vaping companies learn from the industry trying to sell these products, and they get better and better at selling them, we’re also get getting better and better at preventing it. So that’s the good news is that we’re learning too.

[00:15:27] Jessica Fowler: Absolutely,

“Moving Beyond Scare Tactics in Youth Prevention: Effective Strategies for the Future”

[00:15:31] Jake White: I remember when we first started connecting on LinkedIn, and we were kind of chatting back and forth. I was really encouraged to talk to you because you have a view of the whole person mental health basic needs. Can you just talk a little bit about how, what are those areas around prevention and mental health that affect it, that we need to be aware of?

[00:16:01] Jessica Fowler: So I’m really very fortunate that the place that I work, we really do focus on the whole person, and we say the whole child and the whole family. So we have people who are dieticians, or work in nutrition and help with making sure there’s food access in the community that we’re in how to cook recipes for that’s affordable, things like that. So we even have people who work on reproductive health and education on that. So it’s a whole health education, environment. And I think that’s been really fortunate for me to be able to start in that compared to others I have met. So we do take that whole approach. And then with my treatment background, just hearing where people have struggled, why they may have started using has been really just push my work. We have to target the whole person. So if a child is struggling and the teenager struggling does not have all the basic needs met, such as access to food access to a state environment, safe school environment, they’re likely their risk factors in groups, for substance use, for mental health challenges. Trauma is one of the number one risk factors for that’s all challenges and substance use, though we can address and meet those needs that we can help reduce, we can help reduce those risk factors. So I think it’s really important and how it all ties together. If our mental wellness is on the low end of that continuum, then our physical health is impacted as well and vice versa. So, to me, we really got to hit that all to be able to have successful prevention.

[00:17:45] Jake White: I love that. And it’s just a great example of how in prevention sometimes we focus on, we need to educate about this one substance or about one substance, because it’s the latest trend. And sometimes the answer is, “Yes, we needed to do that, because we need to stop the bleeding and stuff like that.” But the other times, it’s more like, hey, the root of the problem is where we need to look, you’re, you’re looking at all these little leaves on the outside, because you can see them and you see they look sick and stuff like that. But the way you’re going to get this tree healthy this community this person is by focusing on the ground and the roots and like what’s actually going on, which might be, I have a terrifying whole life or I’m not getting the nutrition that I need, or whatever I’m coping with, is like, that’s actually a bigger need, than he made me the substance that I’m using, because it all stems from there.

[00:18:46] Jessica Fowler: So it’s focusing upstream, is looking at what’s the upstream and not the here now and you’re right. We do focus a lot on right now this substates. And that’s always going to change like air through every few years. It’s a different substance and that’s great. But again, it’s like it’s focusing on upstream, we can meet those things all the way up the stream, and hopefully it will stop before it gets down.

[00:19:08] Jake White: And that’s the real prevention generational work that we’re excited about. Because we see the potential of real cultural community change. That’s really awesome. I like to ask this question, is there anything happening in the prevention field that you are like, “That’s cringy we should stop doing that.” Any pet peeves in our field?

[00:19:38] Jessica Fowler: For me, I would say scare tactics. There’s a lot of different ways scare tactics are still being used and not just substance abused prevention. Like, even with taxi driving, I see it. And research is great, but scare tactics really are not effective. People still want them especially like people in my generation, we gotta have the scary thing. And when we go to like, talk to schools or even just in the community, but then you have the group that’s gonna laugh the group’s, that’s not me things like that, but we really can move away from that really go to evidence based programs, evidence base on so many different levels and even some research base and there’s no standings behind it anymore. They’re just really seeing that that’s not effective. So that’s still my cringe, this a scare tactic. Let’s not do that. Let’s try this route instead.

[00:20:39] Jake White: Well, you’re not alone. I think a lot of people in our field are now realizing that it wasn’t effective, or the data show that wasn’t. And also that the students, young people aren’t motivated by fear. They’re invincible. This isn’t going to happen to me. And that’s silly that you’re trying to tell me that it is. Or the first time I do that, nothing bad happens to me. Now I can trust you. I think there was I forget what book I was reading. But it was talking about how in sales, let’s say an insurance salesperson or a car salesperson, and you’re selling to an adult. They know that adults are more motivated by fear. Because we don’t want anything negative to happen because we like our comforts, because we want to protect the things around us that we have. And the thought of losing something is more fearful than the benefit of gaining something. But there’s an age where that flips. And when we’re dealing with young people, they don’t necessarily have that. Honestly, now I’m just having this realization right now. Maybe it’s because the frontal lobe isn’t fully developed is that protection and foresight and forecast isn’t developed. So these young people are scary things. I’m glad my parents were moved by it, but not me. They thought it was a great program. And they set up this a car crash, or whatever it might be, or this scenario. And my parents thought was really great. The adults who are on the committee’s think, “Oh, this is so powerful, and that it misses the mark when it comes to our students”.

[00:22:22] Jessica Fowler: I think a lot of times it does go with their brain development, we look at like, you go talk to a teen right now. And you say like, it’s texting dangerous when you’re driving? They’ll tell you right. But they did they get a text message while driving, there are so many different things that go on in their mind, because of the way they’re still processing. This is my friend, if I don’t respond, is my friend gonna think I’m mad at them or vice versa? Like, what is the risk in that? Should I answer that text? So my friend doesn’t think I’m mad at them or do I continue driving? So they’re processing or they’re still learning. And as adults, we’ve seen enough bad accident, or enough it is we know the dangers. So we are a little bit more motivated by we could lose a lot, we have a lot of things as an adult and the kids are they’re still learning that and that’s less why we got to meet them with going to work with them and for them.

[00:23:17] Jake White: Exactly. And that’s the messaging to like you said is that we’re moving away from scare tactics. And that is the cringy part, part of our culture still loves that is by telling someone what not to do, we haven’t necessarily helped them figure out what they can do. So in that example, that you just said, which is like, “Don’t text and drive,” but I still know I’m going to get a text in the car. So what can I do instead? Putting my phone in the backseat or somewhere unaccessible handing it to the person next to me, so that they can answer any texts that I get or read them stuff like that. So I can save lives and I can still be social. Not on my phone personally, but by doing this. And that’s why our program is like, you can still have a social life, have fun, make friends and feel good without using drugs and alcohol. It’s a great message instead don’t do drugs. Or I would love to ask you about maybe some of the projects that you’ve done so far. And I didn’t even ask you this. So how long have you been in the field? And then what are some projects that you’ve done or seen that have been really inspiring?

[00:24:41] Jessica Fowler: Now, I’ve been in the field for prevention since March 2018. It’s about six years going on. I think it’s the hardest because there’s no so many. I was able to like for me it was One of the greatest, most exciting things was  before COVID, we were able to work with a lot of community partners in one of the communities that we work in. And as a community, we created a coalition for substance use prevention, which is amazing. They haven’t had one in a long time, they had a couple like collaborative. So it was really getting into that community work, see them mobilize for something that a lot of people want it. So that was really exciting. But the main thing is getting into I don’t do a lot with like the youth and with the work that I do, but my co-workers do it. It just seem like from 2020 eBay when everything was virtual, and some of the youth we still have because they were younger, and to see them grow and seeing the project. And like I said earlier, for the past couple summers, they’ve been able to go to Cadca, we’ve had one that done presentations with Cadca, but even just locally for in North Carolina, they’ve been doing presentations, and things like that, and just seeing my co-workers getting to do that with the youth and leading, it seems as youth lead is, I think the biggest, exciting thing that I haven’t got to experience since I’ve been in the field.

[00:26:19] Jake White: That’s incredible. And I feel it’s such a gem, when you see students taking on the work and doing that. It feels 100 times better than doing it yourself. Because they’re on fire, they’re making a difference, they’re growing, they’re developing their leadership skills, but not only can you see the sustainability of your project now, because they can do this for the rest of their life, they might coalition or get into the field, or at least take the knowledge and impact the people around them. But you also just get those warm and fuzzies of like, “This is actually why I got in this, this whole thing is I wanted to change young lives.” And firsthand, I always have to remind myself, when I get stuck in the admin work, or I get stuck, like getting too busy and too busy. But imagine those students, because sometimes you get to hear the story that how you’re impacted, most of the time you don’t, but at least you can see the tangible work that they’re putting in, and the ways that they grow within your community. So I love that having a coalition get started, that’s you. And then also seeing students light a fire around this kind of work, and then see them grow through their projects, and even them speaking at their schools and other schools, that’s incredible. One, we were just in Arkansas, and we did a conference with the high school and they have a youth group. And then so what they did is they brought us in to speak to three middle schools, and this high school youth group. And what they did then is we did a training after where we launched basically three new middle school prevention clubs and it was so cool. I love the model that they use. But my best part was like, when students were filing in the high school students were the one handed out T-shirts welcoming students. And when a group got there really, really early. And I was like, check out the crowd. So they’re going to be bored for the next 20 minutes what games do you know. And so they would tell it the game or didn’t have one. So I was like I will. Here’s one that I know, if you want grab a partner go up on stage with a microphone, and you’re gonna facilitate this game and get a competition going. And just seeing them light up. And then when it came time to train, like all of the groups, we could pair up those high school leaders, one of the high school leaders with every one of these new groups of students. So just then, I had that same excitement of, “Dang, this is so cool. We’re building something that’s going to last.” It’s so good. I want to leave you with a chance to say it. If there’s somebody new in prevention, they just got in the field. What’s one piece of advice that you’d want to give them?

[00:29:18] Jessica Fowler: How could they get started so many? I would probably say learn all you can and be patient because it takes a long, long time sometimes to see the effort from the work that you’re doing and that the community is doing, don’t give up like just being aware of that doesn’t happen overnight and take a lot of excitement in those small policies, like a small policy and may be small to you but it’s big to somebody and they’re just as important as those big policies. And to me it’s just looking for the small accomplishments. So people might say, but you just stick with it, learn all you can and really work together with the community. It’s a lot. It’s very powerful.

[00:30:12] Jake White: I love that. Thank you so much, Jessica, for being on the show.

[00:30:16] Jessica Fowler: Well proud to be. Thanks for having me.

[00:30:18] Jake White: Of course. And listen, if you are one of the listeners or viewers on YouTube, thank you for tuning into this episode of Party Talk. I hope that you got inspired today and empowered to keep doing your awesome, incredible work that’s changing communities. And if you have any ideas of new guests that want to be on the show, please write to me, jake@vive18.com. And of course, if you need help getting youth involved in prevention, you can go to vive18.com and we’ll see you next Monday for another episode.